Editing Forum:Disable comments

{{Forumheader/Watercooler}}{{discussionclosed|Talk pages will be restored.}}
Ahem. The aim of this proposal is to see whether the community on this wiki would agree to disable the "Comments" section at the bottom of every page. Now, that's not as evil as it sounds. That doesn't mean that we won't be able to discuss and comment on pages; quite the contrary, it will still allow us to do that, while limiting the amount of spam and troll comments posted by IPs.

Disabling comments will replace them with every page having a relevant talk page, just as user pages do. So, for example, a page called Nitrome Boss would have a talk page called Talk:Nitrome Boss. Pages with a prefix namespace, such as Nitrome:Signatures, would have Nitrome talk:Signatures. This means that we will still be able to comment and discuss, and these comments won't appear on the bottom of a page, contributing to the look of a "pro" wiki; note that most, if not all developed wikis (5,000+ pages) have comments disabled. Also, as I said, this will help reduce spam and trolling. Directly quoted from another wiki:

"I may have a suggestion for the wiki regarding comments. I was wondering if it's possible to change the pages' structure and replace the comments space with a dedicated talk page (I don't know if it's the correct term) for each page (like any page of http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki). Sadly most of the comments are trivial personal opinions (i.e. combo comments about how scary alexander's portrait on low sanity is or the comparison between F.E.A.R. and Amnesia) or worse, gibberish and trolling. Very little of them are actually meant for contribution to the wiki. Writing on the talk page requires more effort than writing a comment (a couple minutes vs a few seconds, which on the internet is an abyss) so this would discourage viewers to leave the first thing that comes to mind or trolls to, well, troll. And, hopefully, who wants to contribute writes a good and comprehensive topic on the talk page. Obviously, the talk pages aren't troll-proof, but at least their art wouldn't be under the eyes of every reader.
I hope you read and maybe consider this suggestion and I'm also very sorry for not giving you any real instructions on how to do this, but my wiki knowledge is limited on page writing (with solid limits there too)."

--Zezzie

So there. I hope you will consider and agree to this proposal. To see what the talk pages would look like, just go to [[w:c:Runescape:Special:RandomPage|a random page on RSW]]. {{Signatures/Bluefire2}}

EDIT: Apparently there is a bug with the comments reappearing if they are disabled. I won't go into too much detail, apart from that it can be completely nullified with a few lines of JavaScript (in [[MediaWiki:Wikia.js]]; the bug does not apply to Monobook):

<pre>
/* Temporary fix for talk page comments bug */
if ($('.wikia-button.comments.secondary').attr('href') == '#WikiaArticleComments' && skin == 'oasis') {
    $(document).ready(function() {
        $('.wikia-button.comments.secondary').attr('href', '/wiki/Talk:' + wgPageName).html($('.wikia-button.comments.secondary').html().replace('Comments', 'Discussion'))
    })
}
</pre>
{{Signatures/Bluefire2}} 18:49, January 24, 2012 (UTC)
<!--
=====================================================================
*********************************************************************
Note: Before replying, MAKE SURE YOU HAVE READ ALL OF THE ABOVE TEXT!
*********************************************************************
=====================================================================
-->

'''Oppose''' - Sorry, but I need article comments for the Battle of the Week. It's easier to suggest battles.
{{Signatures/Santiago González Martín}} 19:01, January 24, 2012 (UTC)
:And you will have your article comments! ...On the relevant talk page. Plus, I don't think using article comments to suggest battles of the week is a good idea in the first place. Create a page called something like Nitrome:Battle of the week, and have people post comments there (or on its talk page). Also, talk pages tend to be a LOT more organised than comments at the bottom of a page, allowing for proper discussions and debates. {{Signatures/Bluefire2}} 19:23, January 24, 2012 (UTC)
::I read the entire article, but only I think people will not use Talk Pages such as comments. Anyway, they're make the wiki less profesional, so, less believable. OK, I agree...
{{Signatures/Santiago González Martín}} 19:31, January 24, 2012 (UTC)

'''Support''' - Sounds like a good idea. Most comments I have seen were actually not helping the article, but talk between users. Game articles also seem to be filled up with people saying their stuck on a level. I agree to disabling comments. --{{Signatures/NOBODY}} 19:25, January 24, 2012 (UTC)
:Oh no, not this again... Can [[User:Santiago González Martín|a certain person]] please fix his signature? {{Signatures/Bluefire2}} 19:34, January 24, 2012 (UTC)
::[http://nitrome.wikia.com/index.php?title=Template%3ASignatures%2FSantiago_Gonz%C3%A1lez_Mart%C3%ADn&action=historysubmit&diff=51299&oldid=50904 Done...] I think... {{Signatures/Bluefire2}} 19:42, January 24, 2012 (UTC)
I don't really think you should remove it if you remove it it will be harder to talk about pages and sometimes wikia contributers point out mistakes that need to be fixed with comments. [[User:Axiy|Axiy, I'm just using words.]] 19:35, January 24, 2012 (UTC)
:The said wikia contributors are perfectly capable of going on a talk page and saying their stuff there. Just point out the new change on the Main Page or through a message bubble across the whole wiki (I can show you how to do that). {{Signatures/Bluefire2}} 19:42, January 24, 2012 (UTC)
::Well, ok I agree, but can you show me how to do that thing you said. Well but it might be a bit hard. [[User:Axiy|Axiy]] 19:35, January 24, 2012 (UTC)
:::First, please don't write span tags; they aren't required nor do they do anything here. Second, we haven't yet reached a consensus as to what we will do. There is no point in me typing a huge text wall instructing you to do something you may not even do in the first place. {{Signatures/Bluefire2}} 19:56, January 24, 2012 (UTC)

'''Support''' - I can't believe I'm actually saying this (what?), but I agree. Comments were only contributing to vast amounts of spam by Wikia contributors. At first, I thought they would be good for getting feedback on the quality of the article, but I find that using the comments to question the content of a page usually ends up getting drowned out by other comments that are more relevant to the difficulty of the game or something, meaning there is less discussion that is Wiki-related.

With Santi's issue, I once suggested setting up a separate page for Battle of the Week suggestions, but it was quickly abandoned, as the comments seemed easier to use. From what I see, the comments feature will stay if talk pages come back, so it's not something to be entirely concerned about. However, the sudden transition between going from free-for-all article comments to the professional-looking discussion pages might be a bit much for some. Oh, well. Guess all that requires is some advance notice. 'Tis my only concern for now. How will we be deciding whether article comments get disabled or not? Community vote? Argumentative discussion? In all my years-er, months of editing here, we've never really decided anything as a community.

Another question: Is it possible to move Nitrome discussion to its own separate forum? I've set up one already in the [[Forum:Index|forums]] place. {{Signatures/Random-storykeeper}} 00:49, January 25, 2012 (UTC)

'''Neutral''' - I think shutting down talk on pages might be for the best, and I don't like spam at all, but some pages need the talk at the bottom, and shutting down the talk would not advance them. I think shutting down talk only on game pages would work well. The game pages have a lot of spam and questions about levels. Almost never do they have page discussion. I'm not sure if this is possible, but it would stop most spam. Also, if I wanted to discuss about merging two pages, such as Black Cannons (Cheese Dreams) and Cannons (Cheese Dreams), I would either have to
:a) post on an admin's talk page discussing it
:b) use chat to tell someone
:or
:b) make a blog post including it

:I think that it would be harder to do what talk is supposed to do in the first place, which is discussing how to make the article better. I just brought this up, I'm actually not going to support either one. Also, it would give potential users no way to get to know the wiki or the community. {{u|Takeshi64}} 01:26, January 25, 2012 (UTC)


An answer to RSK's question - we need a relatively neutral (and mature) admin to close this in about a week from now, and the way he closes it (succeeded or failed) will depend on his/her evaluation of where the community consensus is pointing. Also, @Takeshi64, don't you guys have a merge template (like on Wikipedia)? {{Signatures/Bluefire2}} 08:47, January 25, 2012 (UTC)
:Oh ffs... Now it's your signature... {{Signatures/Bluefire2}} 10:56, January 25, 2012 (UTC)
::I've replaced your signature with {{t|u}} for now, while I work on getting it fixed. What I want to know first is who made that sig. {{Signatures/Bluefire2}} 16:00, January 25, 2012 (UTC)

This topic has been left unedited for a week. By the way this discussion is going, it seems like comments should be disabled and replaced with talk pages again. I don't want to seem biased or say that I'm the right person to close this discussion, but I also don't want to leave too many forum topics abandoned and not closed. Is it okay to disable the comments yet? {{Signatures/Random-storykeeper}} 01:14, February 3, 2012 (UTC)

:...Am I the only person who actually reads forum posts nowadays? O_O {{Signatures/Random-storykeeper}} 07:41, February 3, 2012 (UTC)
::Go for it {{=P}} {{Signatures/Bluefire2}} 13:40, February 3, 2012 (UTC)
:::'''Oppose/neutral '''- I kind of like the comment part on the pages, although I thought it went a little overboard when the [[Nitrome Must Die]] page got 277 comments. I don't use them a lot, but they are helpful when I have a question about the page.
{{Signatures/Emitewiki2}} 16:09, February 3, 2012 (UTC)
::::Believe me, talk pages work just as well for that kind of thing. If someone wants to post a resourceful comment that will help people, he/she will definitely be bothered to click the button that takes him to the relevant talk page because he/she wants to aid the community; spammers and trolls, on the contrary, will have a higher chance of ''not'' bothering (again, remember, this isn't all just theory; it ''does'' work).

::::By the way, using something like '''Weak oppose''' instead of '''Oppose/neutral''' (which essentially means the same thing) makes discussions and intents a lot clearer. {{Signatures/Bluefire2}} 18:57, February 3, 2012 (UTC)

:::::I also think we should change the layout of these box sigs. I'm '''not''' saying they should be banned altogether; rather, they should be improved. It's just that huge box signatures (and therefore excessive <nowiki><br /></nowiki> tags) and the indent that people use in discussions (the colons) just don't match. {{Signatures/Bluefire2}} 19:03, February 3, 2012 (UTC)

<small>(Resetting indent)</small>Definitely. Using talk pages doesn't mean that no one will be able to provide feedback; it just keeps conversations on their own pages rather than having them float down the article. And on an off topic note, I like these round sig thingys. Everyone's sigs look so cool. {{Signatures/Random-storykeeper}} 23:43, February 3, 2012 (UTC)

:This forum discussion has been going on for well over a week. Judging by community consensus, I will now be disabling article comments. {{Signatures/Random-storykeeper}} 04:53, February 8, 2012 (UTC)